It would be valid but there are plenty of resources ,hospitals, doctors ,nurses and clerical staff to implement NATIONALIZED HEALTHCARE .
Fear mongering abstraction of the issue , a ham handed attempt to play on stereotypical concepts.
The Stories of today’s system are far more frightening than waiting a few days for an appointment.
how about trying the free market approach. Don’t kid yourself – what we got now is by no means a free market, but heavily controlled and regulated. That included hospitals that MUST treat people even if they have no money. That cost must also be borne by the rest of us. Need more doctors – AMAs got control on that. Any advertising of fees for services, so you can shop around – NONE! We have no free market, but a giant kluge of a system.
Regarding the free market, what are perceived as failures of the free market are instead almost always instances of big business screwing things up in collusion with the government – although it must be noted that the government can screw things up even without big business (witness the Great Depression - a result of the Smoot Hawley tariff and the Fed’s contraction of the money supply).
So, if I read your comment correctly, big business had no hand in making the great depression happen? It was all the fault of government?
Oddly, I thought a part of it was due to the fact the farmers were unable to produce crops in bad, dried out soil, unable to pay their mortgages thus losing their jobs & homes.
The Great Depression had a number of contributing factors. Both big business and government can be faulted. The greed of everyday Americans also contributed. The correct term for the period was laissez- faire capitalism, in other words hands off. There was little government regulation and no transparency. Free market economics as it is presented, by a number of people, today does not assume a lack of regulation is good. It understands that the biggest enemy of capitalism is a successful capitalist. Unregulated capitalism turns into an oligarchy which eliminates the existence of a free market. Free market proponents want to eliminate tariff barriers and market distorting subsidies. No real free market policy has ever truly seen the light of day.
@ HQ - you have to keep in mind that a major talking point on the right is that a government option would somehow run all the private insurers out of business. That is, after all, how a “we will give a government option” became “They will take over healthcare.”
Obama’s example was absurd, but it DID show that this fear, at least, was unfounded.
You nay-sayers are so negative. Adding 47 million new entrants, slashing reimbursements and not adding any new physicians, nurses or hospitals will have no effect on quality of care. On top of that add QARY. A formula for disaster.
There is nothing so bad that government can’t make worse.
HQ, I did not state it was your fear in particular. However, I have heard people state the talking point that a public plan would lead to government healthcare as the public option would eventually lead to the ruin of all its competitors. You personally may or may not have claimed that, but others have. I believe Obama was trying to address that point.
The whole talking point about “death councils” was patently untrue. Palin and the right-wing media succeeded in convincing the people who were drafting the bill that the measure would be unpopular, but that does not mean it would be “a bad idea”. It was one service that doctors sometimes provide, the question is if it should be compensated or not. Palin spun it out of any proportion and invented stuff like bureaucrats deciding who lives and who dies. That is exactly one of the thing the reform is supposed to address by trying to cut back on arbitrary claim denials - because right now it is bureaucrats (albeit ones working for private companies) who decide who gets coverage and who does not..
When people get greedy and stupid, there is a market correction – well at least there is supposed to be… wait – don’t bother we’ll just bail them out – you can’t be too stupid but what the gov-ment isn’t supposed to bail you out. 15 and pregnant – not your fault, paid too much for that house – fogetaboutit – we got you covered. Drugging, bangin’ w/o a condom – got you a little dee-zees step right up and get your free health care! Grow up and take responsibility for your actions! Only children and Democrats think money from Washington is free (William F Buckley)
Most people cannot objectively seek truth because of jaded biases.. such is human nature Humphries and having to reconcile internal conflict to accept another viewpoint often prevents truth from ever being relevant..
To DrC : Reason is deducted from observational opinion reliant of the subjectivity of fact.. In regards to politics there are no empirical truths that are irrefutable due to the nature of morality versus course of action, so therefore there cannot be an truth relation to proper way of doing things that does not derive from opinion.. Only those who do not under the nature of truth versus science versus human nature would attrempt to place an iron clad parameter upon the human condition..
If it could be proven that a single philosophical moralistic way of life was truth then there would be no debate, but alas such is not the case..
I wish my doctors were as efficient as the DMV! I called a doctor 4 weeks ago to schedule an appointment. The earliest they had was in September.
On August 5th I sent the DMV the paperwork to renew my handicapped placard. It arrived on the 12th.
On the 13th I renewed my registration online. The decal arrived on the 15th.
The last time I visited the DMV in person was when we moved to this state. it took us about an hour to take the written driver’s tests, get new drivers licenses, get the car registered in this state, and get the license plate.
Ramirez doesn’t know much about the way a modern DMV operates
DMV varies from state to state. It is usually less of a nightmare than it used to be. I remember spending 1-2 hrs per visit pre internet. Online has helped a lot.
It does have meaning DrC your just failing to grasp it.. I’ll just break it down into smaller concepts for you.. We reason i.e. work through things based on our observations which is biased by our opinions. Our opinions are modified by how reliant we are on the subject matter/source/personal involvement as it affects us (whether its directly relevant to a person in the opinion) which changes our perception of philosophies which we construe to be fact regardless of the perceptions of others not impacted by the same factors. ..
Its a basic aspect of cultural psychology which is founded upon empirical data collected from human perception studies..
Yes it is words strung out into sentences, but they are relevant and have meaning if you stop to think about it.. but thats the problem with blogging.. Lots of typing, not alot of thinking.. Knee jerk reactions..
meowdam almost 15 years ago
It would be valid but there are plenty of resources ,hospitals, doctors ,nurses and clerical staff to implement NATIONALIZED HEALTHCARE . Fear mongering abstraction of the issue , a ham handed attempt to play on stereotypical concepts. The Stories of today’s system are far more frightening than waiting a few days for an appointment.
believecommonsense almost 15 years ago
Ramirez continues his near-perfect batting average of sticking his head in the sand to ignore all issues not championed by the rabid right
MaryWorth Premium Member almost 15 years ago
I was at the DMV on West 34th Street Friday… took me 40 minutes to get my business done! Not bad!
toasteroven almost 15 years ago
So, this is a comment on health care as it is today, right?
Becuase I was in the E.R. about a week back, and this is how it looked.
I love how the opponents of government health care never seem to offer any concrete alternatives to the system we have now.
ynnek58 almost 15 years ago
how about trying the free market approach. Don’t kid yourself – what we got now is by no means a free market, but heavily controlled and regulated. That included hospitals that MUST treat people even if they have no money. That cost must also be borne by the rest of us. Need more doctors – AMAs got control on that. Any advertising of fees for services, so you can shop around – NONE! We have no free market, but a giant kluge of a system.
meowdam almost 15 years ago
What a waste of artistic talent- Micheal I love your Art- hate your political sense
Madman2001 almost 15 years ago
Regarding the free market, what are perceived as failures of the free market are instead almost always instances of big business screwing things up in collusion with the government – although it must be noted that the government can screw things up even without big business (witness the Great Depression - a result of the Smoot Hawley tariff and the Fed’s contraction of the money supply).
cjr53 almost 15 years ago
So, if I read your comment correctly, big business had no hand in making the great depression happen? It was all the fault of government?
Oddly, I thought a part of it was due to the fact the farmers were unable to produce crops in bad, dried out soil, unable to pay their mortgages thus losing their jobs & homes.
meowdam almost 15 years ago
vacuity -wow- great word - Fox news leaps to mind
Gladius almost 15 years ago
The Great Depression had a number of contributing factors. Both big business and government can be faulted. The greed of everyday Americans also contributed. The correct term for the period was laissez- faire capitalism, in other words hands off. There was little government regulation and no transparency. Free market economics as it is presented, by a number of people, today does not assume a lack of regulation is good. It understands that the biggest enemy of capitalism is a successful capitalist. Unregulated capitalism turns into an oligarchy which eliminates the existence of a free market. Free market proponents want to eliminate tariff barriers and market distorting subsidies. No real free market policy has ever truly seen the light of day.
WestTex13 almost 15 years ago
The government could make a house of ill repute go bankrupt with mismanagement, so its hard to have faith in them doing anything effectively..
4uk4ata almost 15 years ago
@ HQ - you have to keep in mind that a major talking point on the right is that a government option would somehow run all the private insurers out of business. That is, after all, how a “we will give a government option” became “They will take over healthcare.”
Obama’s example was absurd, but it DID show that this fear, at least, was unfounded.
GNWachs almost 15 years ago
You nay-sayers are so negative. Adding 47 million new entrants, slashing reimbursements and not adding any new physicians, nurses or hospitals will have no effect on quality of care. On top of that add QARY. A formula for disaster.
There is nothing so bad that government can’t make worse.
chromosome Premium Member almost 15 years ago
Michael Ramirez, though I rarely agree with you, I find your art magnificent.
4uk4ata almost 15 years ago
HQ, I did not state it was your fear in particular. However, I have heard people state the talking point that a public plan would lead to government healthcare as the public option would eventually lead to the ruin of all its competitors. You personally may or may not have claimed that, but others have. I believe Obama was trying to address that point.
The whole talking point about “death councils” was patently untrue. Palin and the right-wing media succeeded in convincing the people who were drafting the bill that the measure would be unpopular, but that does not mean it would be “a bad idea”. It was one service that doctors sometimes provide, the question is if it should be compensated or not. Palin spun it out of any proportion and invented stuff like bureaucrats deciding who lives and who dies. That is exactly one of the thing the reform is supposed to address by trying to cut back on arbitrary claim denials - because right now it is bureaucrats (albeit ones working for private companies) who decide who gets coverage and who does not..
ynnek58 almost 15 years ago
When people get greedy and stupid, there is a market correction – well at least there is supposed to be… wait – don’t bother we’ll just bail them out – you can’t be too stupid but what the gov-ment isn’t supposed to bail you out. 15 and pregnant – not your fault, paid too much for that house – fogetaboutit – we got you covered. Drugging, bangin’ w/o a condom – got you a little dee-zees step right up and get your free health care! Grow up and take responsibility for your actions! Only children and Democrats think money from Washington is free (William F Buckley)
HUMPHRIES almost 15 years ago
Howiee, know “truth”, where’s it in this toon ?
WestTex13 almost 15 years ago
Truth is point of view perception..
Most people cannot objectively seek truth because of jaded biases.. such is human nature Humphries and having to reconcile internal conflict to accept another viewpoint often prevents truth from ever being relevant..
HUMPHRIES almost 15 years ago
DrC, may I save that and use it some time ?
WestTex13 almost 15 years ago
To DrC : Reason is deducted from observational opinion reliant of the subjectivity of fact.. In regards to politics there are no empirical truths that are irrefutable due to the nature of morality versus course of action, so therefore there cannot be an truth relation to proper way of doing things that does not derive from opinion.. Only those who do not under the nature of truth versus science versus human nature would attrempt to place an iron clad parameter upon the human condition..
If it could be proven that a single philosophical moralistic way of life was truth then there would be no debate, but alas such is not the case..
PlainBill almost 15 years ago
I wish my doctors were as efficient as the DMV! I called a doctor 4 weeks ago to schedule an appointment. The earliest they had was in September.
On August 5th I sent the DMV the paperwork to renew my handicapped placard. It arrived on the 12th.
On the 13th I renewed my registration online. The decal arrived on the 15th.
The last time I visited the DMV in person was when we moved to this state. it took us about an hour to take the written driver’s tests, get new drivers licenses, get the car registered in this state, and get the license plate.
Ramirez doesn’t know much about the way a modern DMV operates
Gladius almost 15 years ago
DMV varies from state to state. It is usually less of a nightmare than it used to be. I remember spending 1-2 hrs per visit pre internet. Online has helped a lot.
ynnek58 almost 15 years ago
Humpster You might want to understand that statement before you unleash it since, in your case, it would be self-incriminating.
WestTex13 almost 15 years ago
It does have meaning DrC your just failing to grasp it.. I’ll just break it down into smaller concepts for you.. We reason i.e. work through things based on our observations which is biased by our opinions. Our opinions are modified by how reliant we are on the subject matter/source/personal involvement as it affects us (whether its directly relevant to a person in the opinion) which changes our perception of philosophies which we construe to be fact regardless of the perceptions of others not impacted by the same factors. ..
Its a basic aspect of cultural psychology which is founded upon empirical data collected from human perception studies..
Yes it is words strung out into sentences, but they are relevant and have meaning if you stop to think about it.. but thats the problem with blogging.. Lots of typing, not alot of thinking.. Knee jerk reactions..