The $40,000,000 that Democrat Senators spent to produce this crap might as well have went to propaganda commercials on Al Jazeera.EVERY American involved in this supposed “torture” says that these techniques saved American lives by preventing terrorist attacks.Btw…. Were some Terrorists uncomforted?Ya buddy! They were SO lucky they were in American custody.They were terrorists trying to kill even more than the 3,000 Americans on 9/11.If you think that’s torture, try talking to a POW that was in the hands of the Vietnamese, Japanese or Germans and ask them what torture is. It wasn’t lack of sleep and loud music they went through. It was electric shock to genitals, acid poured on skin and eyes gouged out, to name a few.Oh and try to talk to an American that’s been captured by the Islamic State (ISIS). That’s right you can’t, their heads were sawed off alive with a knife.
isn’t it great how the dems want to treat terrorist. if you are a terrorist you get free health care the day you are sick. if you are a vet you get wait until you dead health care. so which one of those groups does the dems think are the bad guys.
The consensus is that the Interrogation program yielded actionable information, but not the “enhanced interrogation” (torture) portion. In fact Sheik Khalid was providing information under conventional methods until torture began, then he clammed up..Those with experience (McCain) says it is not effective, but provides bad intel. .Some of the bad intel on which the disastrous Iraq war debacle was based was obtained from torture methods..The torture described sounds like something out of the dark ages. In fact, I doubt the dark ages did rectal hydration. .When someone is water-boarded 180 times, that is not about obtaining actionable intel, it is about retribution for 9/11. .This is some of the most primitive, uncivilized, ineffective, and counter-productive action that any civilized country can take. It has probably set back the path to world peace and America’s reputation for generations. (Can you imagine the Chinese or Cubans taking America seriously when they criticize their record on human rights?) It is sickening.
The point of having moral standards is to have them. If we say we are good people who don’t torture, then that’s what we should hold to. Those who are justifying these acts of torture seem a lot like (the bad kind of) moral relativists.
The GOP is saying that the sky is falling.As if reporting that WE know that we’ve been torturing prisoners as much as THEY know that we’ve been torturing prisoners would make any difference about how much they want to kill us.
1. It is the flood of REPUBLICANS (minus McCain who knows better) claiming the report will destroy America’s safety and cause the sky to fall. (by saying again what’s been known for over a decade, especially in the affected Muslim communities)
2. Torture actually doesn’t work to get facts, but it does act as revenge, and stimulates the ViCTIMS to retaliate if freed.
3. Given techniques I know from experience, I assure you that in less than 20 minutes I could have Lisa, or Dick Cheney, talking and saying what I wanted them to, but it doesn’t mean any of it would be true.
Not that I support torture (because I don’t) but that old lame argument about the victim saying what you want is inane to say the least. The only way they’d say what you wanted was if you told them what to say in advance. So the question becomes, "What are you and your buddies planning on blowing up next?, not did you blow up XYZ?
You confuse “a willingness to employ methods to make prisoners more pliable to provide information to help us” with “a wonderful thing to do to people.” Of course it’s an horrific experience. But I would trade any number of their terrorists’ comfort and even mental health (and, to an extent, their physical health) to ensure the safety of even one of our citizens… even one of you guys on here with whom I disagree. To me, terrorists aren’t human beings; they are things… and should be treated with the same level of compassion that implies. After all, every person in the military who has deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan has had to make that transition to mentally enable themselves to extinguish the life of an enemy (which at some points are children). Once again, one more thing civilians can’t fathom or comprehend because you haven’t been there… and you would call us monsters for doing it.And Incredulous makes a very valid point: The theory that you can get them to ADMIT to anything is clear. But you can’t elicit information from them because they “tell you what you want to hear.” When they were waterboarding MSM, they weren’t interrogating him during the process. They waterboarded him some 11-15 times (iirc) before they even asked him the first question. The CIA employed methods that made the individuals in question more mentally pliable and willing to divulge information. They didn’t torture, ask question, torture some more, ask question, repeat ad nauseum. So trout, your argument of point 3 is moot and irrelevant.
Soufon was an FBI interrogator and getting solid intel, UNTIL, the CIA stepped in with enhanced techniques. I saw him interviewed some years ago, and everything he said made sense (having been an “interrogator”), and he was interviewd by Maddow again tonight. He is the type of person folks should listen to.
ConserveGov over 9 years ago
The $40,000,000 that Democrat Senators spent to produce this crap might as well have went to propaganda commercials on Al Jazeera.EVERY American involved in this supposed “torture” says that these techniques saved American lives by preventing terrorist attacks.Btw…. Were some Terrorists uncomforted?Ya buddy! They were SO lucky they were in American custody.They were terrorists trying to kill even more than the 3,000 Americans on 9/11.If you think that’s torture, try talking to a POW that was in the hands of the Vietnamese, Japanese or Germans and ask them what torture is. It wasn’t lack of sleep and loud music they went through. It was electric shock to genitals, acid poured on skin and eyes gouged out, to name a few.Oh and try to talk to an American that’s been captured by the Islamic State (ISIS). That’s right you can’t, their heads were sawed off alive with a knife.
colinmichaeljames over 9 years ago
Chemicals? Pain? Punish?
Reppr Premium Member over 9 years ago
Democrats are ALWAYS crying, “The sky is falling!!!!!!”
cuthwald over 9 years ago
isn’t it great how the dems want to treat terrorist. if you are a terrorist you get free health care the day you are sick. if you are a vet you get wait until you dead health care. so which one of those groups does the dems think are the bad guys.
Gypsy8 over 9 years ago
The consensus is that the Interrogation program yielded actionable information, but not the “enhanced interrogation” (torture) portion. In fact Sheik Khalid was providing information under conventional methods until torture began, then he clammed up..Those with experience (McCain) says it is not effective, but provides bad intel. .Some of the bad intel on which the disastrous Iraq war debacle was based was obtained from torture methods..The torture described sounds like something out of the dark ages. In fact, I doubt the dark ages did rectal hydration. .When someone is water-boarded 180 times, that is not about obtaining actionable intel, it is about retribution for 9/11. .This is some of the most primitive, uncivilized, ineffective, and counter-productive action that any civilized country can take. It has probably set back the path to world peace and America’s reputation for generations. (Can you imagine the Chinese or Cubans taking America seriously when they criticize their record on human rights?) It is sickening.
Gypsy8 over 9 years ago
Thanks. I have sibling, offspring, nieces and nephews who are American/Canadian.
woodwork over 9 years ago
The US does all the things that “those people” do…the US just lies about it better.
6.6TA over 9 years ago
It is reliable: a day with Ms. Benson is a day without sunshine.
lonecat over 9 years ago
The point of having moral standards is to have them. If we say we are good people who don’t torture, then that’s what we should hold to. Those who are justifying these acts of torture seem a lot like (the bad kind of) moral relativists.
Nebulous Premium Member over 9 years ago
The GOP is saying that the sky is falling.As if reporting that WE know that we’ve been torturing prisoners as much as THEY know that we’ve been torturing prisoners would make any difference about how much they want to kill us.
eugene57 over 9 years ago
“The easily duped remain so.”We are sorry you are tortured that others are trying to make peoples lives better.
Dtroutma over 9 years ago
1. It is the flood of REPUBLICANS (minus McCain who knows better) claiming the report will destroy America’s safety and cause the sky to fall. (by saying again what’s been known for over a decade, especially in the affected Muslim communities)
2. Torture actually doesn’t work to get facts, but it does act as revenge, and stimulates the ViCTIMS to retaliate if freed.
3. Given techniques I know from experience, I assure you that in less than 20 minutes I could have Lisa, or Dick Cheney, talking and saying what I wanted them to, but it doesn’t mean any of it would be true.
eugene57 over 9 years ago
sorry you live with such a depressing world view.
walkingmancomics over 9 years ago
Bengazi! Bengazi! BENGAZI!!!!!the sky! the sky! the sky!
Incredulous over 9 years ago
Not that I support torture (because I don’t) but that old lame argument about the victim saying what you want is inane to say the least. The only way they’d say what you wanted was if you told them what to say in advance. So the question becomes, "What are you and your buddies planning on blowing up next?, not did you blow up XYZ?
IAI
UpaCoCoCreek Premium Member over 9 years ago
Tell that to that looney liberal John McCain!
Wraithkin over 9 years ago
You confuse “a willingness to employ methods to make prisoners more pliable to provide information to help us” with “a wonderful thing to do to people.” Of course it’s an horrific experience. But I would trade any number of their terrorists’ comfort and even mental health (and, to an extent, their physical health) to ensure the safety of even one of our citizens… even one of you guys on here with whom I disagree. To me, terrorists aren’t human beings; they are things… and should be treated with the same level of compassion that implies. After all, every person in the military who has deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan has had to make that transition to mentally enable themselves to extinguish the life of an enemy (which at some points are children). Once again, one more thing civilians can’t fathom or comprehend because you haven’t been there… and you would call us monsters for doing it.And Incredulous makes a very valid point: The theory that you can get them to ADMIT to anything is clear. But you can’t elicit information from them because they “tell you what you want to hear.” When they were waterboarding MSM, they weren’t interrogating him during the process. They waterboarded him some 11-15 times (iirc) before they even asked him the first question. The CIA employed methods that made the individuals in question more mentally pliable and willing to divulge information. They didn’t torture, ask question, torture some more, ask question, repeat ad nauseum. So trout, your argument of point 3 is moot and irrelevant.
Dtroutma over 9 years ago
Soufon was an FBI interrogator and getting solid intel, UNTIL, the CIA stepped in with enhanced techniques. I saw him interviewed some years ago, and everything he said made sense (having been an “interrogator”), and he was interviewd by Maddow again tonight. He is the type of person folks should listen to.