Doonesbury by Garry Trudeau for March 07, 2013

There certainly has been a lot in the press lately about the U of P (P.U.?) Today, Colorado Public Radio reported that within the next twelve years or so, all of CO’s public higher ed will become private due to the rapid dwindling of state support. Tuition costs have risen exponentially in recent years. Well, they’ve risen a lot, anyway.

….another rock thrown!!

Except for ships (Speaking as an old Navy man). We refer to ships as “she” because they’re like women — They’re beautiful, sleek and graceful, and it takes a lot of money and paint and hard work to keep them that way

Does U. of Phoenix offer those “______ Studies” degrees that are good only for employing “______ Studies” professors and Starbucks clerks?

This a step up?

At for profit schools you get educated. At public schools you get indoctrinated.

“Partly accredited?” Is that like the curate’s egg: “good in parts, my Lord”? As in “Not actually good at all”…?

“At for profit schools you get educated. At public schools you get indoctrinated.”

To use the polite term, bovine excrement.

All schools indoctrinate. It’s unavoidable. A school that tries not to indoctrinate any specific corporate or government agenda will simply indoctrinate the agenda that indoctrination and agendas are bad, which the often (but not always) are.

We have traditionally dealt with this problem by having a variety of schooling methods: home schooling, public schools, religious schools, private non-religious schools, and now corporate schools. As long as students (and their parents, who have traditionally had a fairly major intput to college-choice decisions because they’ll be paying for a good chunk of the tuition) have a choice and are willing to put in the effort to make a reasonably informed choice, society will muddle through. It’s only when one style gets a monopoly that we have cause to worry about the future of our society.

partly accredited. aah, the use of words to scam over those partly asleep/zombies aka Republicans. been working for the last 30 years, since St. Reagan. and we have all seen how well tht works out for the 99%. lol

ah, a Brave new World/aka the New World Order.

to watch the Right kowtow like obediant slaves is so astounding. Money, the only God the Rigth worships. that petty figure of Jesus the Right has totally forgotten in their new Worship of that Golden Calf. seems i read about this same Baal from ancient history, talk about old time Religion. lol

ah Walden and Zipper pieces in a fallen empire

and oral roberts u you get educated. liar.

For profit + corporations – governmental regulations = anarcho-capitalism = environmental destruction and collapse = armageddon

I’m glad I don’t know anything about higher education.

So the ignorant right-wing troll is criticizing someone else for being a shrill for “blatantly stupid” causes. Pot, meet kettle. At least liberals have made it past second grade.

there’s no inherent reason that the profit motive precludes quality’-Um, yes there is. Once you start making a profit, it will never be enough. The ‘stakeholders’ will always demand more, or sue you for not providing it, and to get there, you will sacrifice everything of real value. Quality is the first thing to go, not the last.-“Do your credits transfer?” " Of course, every school takes our credits. Now, sign right here on the dotted line."

right up to the last sentence i thought you were describing the tea party to a T.. Not projecting its stupidity…

While the comment section is once again being usurped by trolls, there are a couple of very interesting ideas regarding “for profit” and “not-for-profit” institutions of education being raised.While the attrition rate in such institutions as University of Phoenix is extremely high, and many of the “universities” are considered inferior, if not outright scams, there is , I think something else that we are not addressing that pertains to both kinds of institutes of learning.That is, the trend away from actual classroom training and the move to virtual teaching. More and more colleges and universities are offering their lecture online and as many businesses have discovered, the cost online power point presentation and online testing, is not only cost-effective but when structured properly, is more efficacious than an actual classroom/conference room environment. Like it or not, this is the way education is trending in the future.

@puddleglum

““Private” is not the same as “for profit.” "

**

That’s right, and I should have put a space between my comment about the University of Phoenix (for-profit) and the next remarks on the assumed eventual privatization of Colorado’s public institutions of higher learning. In addition to our sketchy for-profit colleges, some of which have been involved in legal action over deceptive practices, we have numerous very fine taxpayer-subsidized colleges and universities, and an excellent community-college system. I should have made it clear I was just musing about two different things, both of which are related to the issue of the cost to students and the value they receive. Our state-supported schools offer far higher value per student dollar than the for-profits, and the taxpayer support they now receive enables students to attend who cannot afford our (also very fine) private colleges and universities.

>>>>

“Profit” is a multifaceted concept here, isn’t it? There seems to be little or no profit to students in attending the for-profit schools. Subsidizing higher education for our lower-income students profits our state by allowing many of these students to work at much better jobs than their parents had, with a higher quality of life, which profits them monetarily and the rest of us socially!

Exponential can be good, with the right exponent.

For what it’s worth, the French Ecole Normale, or Ecole Normale Superieure as it now is, certainly no longer trains teachers. It’s one of the grandes ecoles which provide France with its philosophers, government leaders, etc. The ENS in Paris is currently ranked 33rd in the world list of higher education institutions, two places above UCLA.

Do any colleges actually teach anything. I’ve met college graduates that are as dumb as a box of rocks.

Rickopolis: Yes, colleges actually do teach; it is up to the student to do the learning.

Many of the smart people I know are college grads, some with multiple degrees. One of the smartest people I know is a high-school dropout who has self-educated (via reading and listening) in his areas of interest until he can hold his own in conversations on just about any topic. One of the least intelligent people I’ve met was a state legislator, a lawyer, who chaired a committee that was dealing with an issue I was concerned about. He went on and on about his “fine Jesuit education.” Some months later he was out of the legislature and in the news, with a DUI and a home foreclosure. People can be smart in some ways and dumb in others.

“It’s one reason why the educationists – particularly the Progressives/“Liberal” fascists who dominate in this realm of bogosity – have always nursed a particular hate for the Catholic parochial schools. "I’d like to see you back that up with some source material. I don’t think anyone in the liberal establishment cared one way or the other about the Catholic school system until the folks pushing vouchers appeared on the scene. If you want to send your kids to a school where they will be indoctrinated in a particular dogma, you can pay out of your pocket, or just send them to CCD.Having the advantage of attending both Catholic schools & public schools, I can tell you that both have their share of good & bad teachers. The Catholic school teachers make a lot less money, though. Most of the good ones moved on after a few years.

There is a big distinction between private colleges, which boast most of the ‘elite’ schools & the ‘for-profit’ institutions like U of P. The ‘for-profit’ schools have graduation rates far below either public or private colleges, & they operate off of federal grants & loans to the students.

" If someone wants to go to a “for-profit” what business is it of yours? "It’s my business because more likely than not, they are getting my tax dollars in the form of grants, loans & tax breaks. If we tighten up the rules on what schools qualify for this money, a lot of the ‘for profit’ schools would disappear.

“Disinclined as I am to support an institution enshrining any of the various Protestant heresies”You should meet one of the other posters, who goes by “OrthodoxCatholic”. You’d get along swimmingly, until one of you kills the other.

You should refrain from ranting as you cannot distinguish between a “quote” and a “paraphrase”. Did the nuns give you social promotions?

Have you ever heard of the General Motors Institute? It’s in Flint, MI. It’s also where they teach a particular type of INBRED automotive engineering curriculom(sp). Those who graduate from there have a college degree but comparative and critical thinking is not in the course work. Those same graduates, can work for any GM facility in the world and be in lock step with their brothers anywhere else in the world. Then you wonder why innovation has fallen off so in the American Auto industry. It is a corporate school that considers profit to be perfectly turned out clones of older engineers.

If you think a bunch of liberals were behind Pierce vs.Society of Sisters back in 1922, I have a bridge to sell you. I thought about bringing up the general anti-Catholic/anti-immigrant sentiment that was common till about 40 years ago, but I thought, “Nah, that’s irrelevant to the discussion at hand.”There were many among the WASP majority who saw sinister motives behind parochial schools regarding both religion & language. (See Meyers vs. Nebraska) They would feel right at home with today’s conservatives, who are complaining about too many immigrants who won’t learn English.In other words, try again!

What cover up?

Wow — it’s a lot easier to get through all the comments when you skip most of them because they are simply offensive. Yuck!!

@lindz.coop**Amen to that!

Got to ya, didn’t I?Seriously, you are talking about Supreme Court cases from the 1920’s. I asked for something more pertinent & you failed.You started out so well today, but Richard Mitchell would be ashamed of you.